Leaders of the European Union have voted to approve a plan to dramatically increase defense spending. The move is a reaction to the U.S. reducing its support for Ukraine in the war against Russia’s invasion. We go to Brussels to understand the ramifications.

And we hear what the series of recent developments in the relationship between the U.S. and Ukraine could mean for peace talks with Russia.

  • CAVOK@lemmy.worldOP
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    28
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    2 days ago

    Although I understand the need, the re-armament of Europe makes me sad. Imagine what we could have done with all this money. Research, culture, decarbonisation, social programs, housing… but instead we have to use it on ways to kill people.

    Sad really.

    • Phoenixz@lemmy.ca
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      7
      ·
      1 day ago

      I’m very happy that Europe finally is letting go of the US, but yeah, it’s sad to see all this money go to waste.

    • federal reverse@feddit.orgM
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      12
      arrow-down
      3
      ·
      edit-2
      2 days ago

      This money literally wouldn’t exist otherwise. Or conversely: We could just make up some more money for housing if we wished to, if the powers that be allowed that. The hard limit is never money, the hard limit is willpower and material resources.

      • CanadaPlus@lemmy.sdf.org
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        edit-2
        2 hours ago

        the hard limit is willpower and material resources.

        Which money is an accounting mechanism for.

        What this actually means is that people will work for tank manufacturers instead of developing civilian EVs or whatever. Same story for the steel and equipment that goes into it.

      • Bogasse@lemmy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        2 days ago

        But this money is willpower and material resources that could be spent elsewhere : research, culture, decarbonisation, social programs, housing…

        • farsinuce@feddit.dk
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          edit-2
          1 day ago

          Though I share your frustration, you just don’t get to have most of those things, if your country gets invaded.

          And if YOUR country is lucky to be left alone, yet only your neighbouring countries are invaded, that is bound to affect you economically regardless.

          From a purely economic perspective, I would think rearming Europe is the least costly thing to do in the long run.

          • Bogasse@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            3
            ·
            edit-2
            1 day ago

            Yeah yeah I 100% align with CAVOK initial’s comment, this seems necessary to me, but sad because the potential aggressors really seem to make the world worse for everyone but themselves. And by “themselves” I don’t mean whole countries, only the sucker leaders.

        • Don_alForno@feddit.org
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          2
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          2 days ago

          Material resources are material resources. Money is a declaration of mutual trust that is created in the central bank’s computers.

          • Bogasse@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            2 days ago

            I don’t get what you are trying to say? You don’t think this money will be used to use material resources and employ people in weapon industry?

            • Don_alForno@feddit.org
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              2
              arrow-down
              1
              ·
              2 days ago

              That’s different from what you said before. (“Money is material resources”). Money can be used to buy material resources, but it is not equal to material resources.

              Believing the latter leads to the assumption that money is somehow sparse (for governments) and governments should e.g. reduce social or infrastructure spendings to finance the military instead of taking on debt.

  • Kidplayer_666@lemm.ee
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    49
    ·
    3 days ago

    I wish all Americans very congratulations on getting Germany to rearm, something you’ve avoided for 70 years

    • witnessbolt@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      28
      ·
      edit-2
      3 days ago

      My fellows are so blind and deep in the cult. I genuinely think it’s going to be dictatorship or civil war.

      That said, Trump is so effective at being anti-war, that he’s got the entirety of Europe re-arming! 10/10

      Stg MAGA’s had a few lines about how Hillary or Kamala would bring us closer to WW3

    • Melchior@feddit.org
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      13
      ·
      2 days ago

      That is not true. Both Germanys did rearm in the Cold War and ended up with massive armies.

    • Melchior@feddit.org
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      15
      ·
      2 days ago

      For those less smart then Trump:

      US being unreliable -> EU does not buy US weapons -> US economy weakens -> Americans have less money -> Demand for eggs falls -> egg prices fall

      • ExtremeDullard@lemmy.sdf.org
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        19
        ·
        2 days ago

        Actually you didn’t quite capture the genius of Trump. It goes like this:

        US dismantles CDC ▶ Bird flu kills all birds ▶ No more eggs ▶ No more price of eggs

        • pulsey@feddit.org
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          4
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          2 days ago

          also no more inflation, because you just set the egg price to an arbitrary negative value like -700 USD and it will balance out all the products getting more expensive.

  • llothar@lemmy.ml
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    9
    ·
    2 days ago

    And nothing from that extra spending will go to US military complex. For what it’s worth it will probably even go down.