Thanks to the campaign and candidates that were so bad they failed to motivate enough voters. Most people aren’t glued to politics and it’s the parties job to go to where those people are and get them interested. Harris, Biden, and the dems failed horribly at doing that
If voters needed additional motivation to vote against that, it’s entirely their fault. “You didn’t convince me enough so now I’m going to kill you”, a line that a cartune villain would say, and we all understand that it’s villain. But " you didn’t convince me enough so I vote for that one who is going to kill millions" is apparently an OK take
Most people aren’t glued to politics. It’s the job of the campaign to get people’s attention and give them a reason to vote. They clearly failed at that because they lost. You can blame human nature but a good campaign takes human nature into account and this campaign was not a good one.
Do you want to win or do you just want to blame the people? If you want to win you have to find a way to motivate them whether they are being reasonable or not
If they aren’t “glued to politics” they will not get any of the messages, so message itself is clearly not the issue here. You will never appeal to voters that don’t care about anything, they can’t hear you. You will never appeal to online left, they don’t care about politics, only about purity contest. You might appear to non-voters, it doesn’t matter they will find an excuse to not vote anyway.
The issue with this election wasn’t anything Dems could do or not do or did wrong. The issue is that America runs on hate and hateful part is united, and the other half isn’t and never will be and half of it actually runs on the same hate just scared to agree.
The only mistake Dems made this time is they forgot what America actually is. Next time they will run regressive right wing old dude and win again, but it will not be a win for anyone.
Win that I want, win for progress is impossible because America doesn’t want it.
Progressive policies are actually popular. Universal healthcare is popular, raising the minimum wage is popular. But the Democratic party will only run on half measures that satisfy no one because they are beholden to their corporate funders
Not according to voters patterns they aren’t. Comments on Reddit, threads on Lemmy and shits on Xitter doesn’t do anything if by the end of the day people who are incredibly active in those threads just don’t vote. It is either because it’s actually not a lot of people doing a lot of noise, or a lot of people who don’t know how American democracy operates, and it doesn’t matter if there is a difference. Promises of progressive politics don’t bring votes, simple as.
When polls come out about individual issues they show Americans in favor of progressive policies. If the Dems can’t turn that into election outcomes it’s their failure
Those polls mean shit, if people who vaguely “want progressive policies” then turn back and either vote directly against them, or just don’t do anything. You can yapp whatever you want, want whatever you want, but if you don’t vote for it, or at least against polar opposite, you might as well put your head up your ass and express your opinions to the audience there.
People who saw Trump, and didn’t vote against him for a candidate that is obviously, demonstrably better on all the issues you can care about, didn’t do it because that candidate wasn’t better enough, they did what they did because they OK with Trump. As to who’s fault it is… I don’t know, human nature probably, lack of education, lead paint, huge number of factors.
As to who’s fault it is… I don’t know, human nature probably, lack of education, lead paint, huge number of factors.
Do you want the Democratic party to take these factors into account and find a way to succeed despite them or do you want them to keep doing the same thing and failing?
Universal healthcare is popular. Raising the minimum wage is popular. Being openly hostile to the robber barrons of our age is incredibly popular.
It is possible to run a left populist campaign and win on these things but that’s not something the dems are comfortable with
Do you give up because people aren’t reasonable? Or do you find a way to appeal to them despite that?
If you pick giving up then you’re letting fascism win
It’s frustrating to have to support a party that doesn’t understand how to run a popular campaign. This isn’t the first time I’ve seen this. The dems will always kowtow to big donors instead of proposing policy that will make average people’s lives better
It’s the people’s responsibility to go out and vote. It doesn’t take much time to look up each candidate. If you have the slightest preference for one candidate, then go out and vote! No need to be glued at politics to do this.
If you don’t want to take this responsibility, fine, but then don’t complain that you don’t like the result.
The perspective that your just outlined lost this election. Do you want to beat fascism? If so you have to gain the interest of people who didn’t come out in this election. If the stakes are really that high are you gonna lecture people or appeal to them?
It’s not really like that at all. Kinda the opposite.
“We would love you to pick up pizza for dinner”
“I generally don’t eat out”
“If you don’t pick up pizza, someone will get lasagna delivered”
“That’s fine. I don’t really care”
“WHY DIDNT YOU GET US PIZZA?! NOW WE ONLY HAVE LASAGNE!!”
If the dems wanted them to go out and pick pizza, they could’ve worked harder to do that. The people that didn’t vote legitimately do not care. The dems needed to give them a reason to care and they didn’t. Is it unfortunate that stopping fascism isn’t a good enough reason? Yes. Did we know that was going to be the case the whole time? Yes. The dems strategy was bad, and people will suffer because of it. The people who didn’t vote will continue to be apathetic.
Maybe you’re right that many are truly apathetic about the situation. For me as a non American it’s just baffling that so many don’t use their privilege to vote. The default attitude should be to vote unless you truly feel your vote doesn’t matter.
It’s also difficult for me to grasp that, when given the option between a party whose policy is to defend the current status quo, and a party whose policy is fascism, the attitude is “meh, whatever”. Most people should have an opinion regarding this.
Not all elections need to be about new exciting changes. Boring is also an option.
Or maybe status quo is so bad people don’t care if it’s replaced by fascism. If that’s the case, then I agree it’s fully DNCs responsibility for the failure.
Thanks to the campaign and candidates that were so bad they failed to motivate enough voters. Most people aren’t glued to politics and it’s the parties job to go to where those people are and get them interested. Harris, Biden, and the dems failed horribly at doing that
If voters needed additional motivation to vote against that, it’s entirely their fault. “You didn’t convince me enough so now I’m going to kill you”, a line that a cartune villain would say, and we all understand that it’s villain. But " you didn’t convince me enough so I vote for that one who is going to kill millions" is apparently an OK take
Most people aren’t glued to politics. It’s the job of the campaign to get people’s attention and give them a reason to vote. They clearly failed at that because they lost. You can blame human nature but a good campaign takes human nature into account and this campaign was not a good one.
Do you want to win or do you just want to blame the people? If you want to win you have to find a way to motivate them whether they are being reasonable or not
If they aren’t “glued to politics” they will not get any of the messages, so message itself is clearly not the issue here. You will never appeal to voters that don’t care about anything, they can’t hear you. You will never appeal to online left, they don’t care about politics, only about purity contest. You might appear to non-voters, it doesn’t matter they will find an excuse to not vote anyway.
The issue with this election wasn’t anything Dems could do or not do or did wrong. The issue is that America runs on hate and hateful part is united, and the other half isn’t and never will be and half of it actually runs on the same hate just scared to agree.
The only mistake Dems made this time is they forgot what America actually is. Next time they will run regressive right wing old dude and win again, but it will not be a win for anyone.
Win that I want, win for progress is impossible because America doesn’t want it.
Progressive policies are actually popular. Universal healthcare is popular, raising the minimum wage is popular. But the Democratic party will only run on half measures that satisfy no one because they are beholden to their corporate funders
Not according to voters patterns they aren’t. Comments on Reddit, threads on Lemmy and shits on Xitter doesn’t do anything if by the end of the day people who are incredibly active in those threads just don’t vote. It is either because it’s actually not a lot of people doing a lot of noise, or a lot of people who don’t know how American democracy operates, and it doesn’t matter if there is a difference. Promises of progressive politics don’t bring votes, simple as.
When polls come out about individual issues they show Americans in favor of progressive policies. If the Dems can’t turn that into election outcomes it’s their failure
Those polls mean shit, if people who vaguely “want progressive policies” then turn back and either vote directly against them, or just don’t do anything. You can yapp whatever you want, want whatever you want, but if you don’t vote for it, or at least against polar opposite, you might as well put your head up your ass and express your opinions to the audience there.
People who saw Trump, and didn’t vote against him for a candidate that is obviously, demonstrably better on all the issues you can care about, didn’t do it because that candidate wasn’t better enough, they did what they did because they OK with Trump. As to who’s fault it is… I don’t know, human nature probably, lack of education, lead paint, huge number of factors.
Do you want the Democratic party to take these factors into account and find a way to succeed despite them or do you want them to keep doing the same thing and failing?
Universal healthcare is popular. Raising the minimum wage is popular. Being openly hostile to the robber barrons of our age is incredibly popular.
It is possible to run a left populist campaign and win on these things but that’s not something the dems are comfortable with
Dont copy paste shit in multiple comments, first of all. Supremely lazy.
Secondly, no. There is a certian point where a reasonable person votes against something, and we were way past that point
Do you give up because people aren’t reasonable? Or do you find a way to appeal to them despite that? If you pick giving up then you’re letting fascism win
At no point did I suggest giving up, it’s just frustrating to have such a slapdash coalition
It’s frustrating to have to support a party that doesn’t understand how to run a popular campaign. This isn’t the first time I’ve seen this. The dems will always kowtow to big donors instead of proposing policy that will make average people’s lives better
It’s the people’s responsibility to go out and vote. It doesn’t take much time to look up each candidate. If you have the slightest preference for one candidate, then go out and vote! No need to be glued at politics to do this.
If you don’t want to take this responsibility, fine, but then don’t complain that you don’t like the result.
The perspective that your just outlined lost this election. Do you want to beat fascism? If so you have to gain the interest of people who didn’t come out in this election. If the stakes are really that high are you gonna lecture people or appeal to them?
That’s like the same energy of
“Do you want pizza or lasagna?”
“I don’t care. Pick whatever”
“Ok I got lasagna for you then”
“No I don’t want lasagna. I want pizza! Why didn’t you try harder to make me choose pizza?”
American people are responsible for voting for Trump. Not the Democratic Party.
You’re gonna give up in the face of fascism. It must not matter to you that much
It’s not really like that at all. Kinda the opposite.
“We would love you to pick up pizza for dinner”
“I generally don’t eat out”
“If you don’t pick up pizza, someone will get lasagna delivered”
“That’s fine. I don’t really care”
“WHY DIDNT YOU GET US PIZZA?! NOW WE ONLY HAVE LASAGNE!!”
If the dems wanted them to go out and pick pizza, they could’ve worked harder to do that. The people that didn’t vote legitimately do not care. The dems needed to give them a reason to care and they didn’t. Is it unfortunate that stopping fascism isn’t a good enough reason? Yes. Did we know that was going to be the case the whole time? Yes. The dems strategy was bad, and people will suffer because of it. The people who didn’t vote will continue to be apathetic.
Maybe you’re right that many are truly apathetic about the situation. For me as a non American it’s just baffling that so many don’t use their privilege to vote. The default attitude should be to vote unless you truly feel your vote doesn’t matter.
It’s also difficult for me to grasp that, when given the option between a party whose policy is to defend the current status quo, and a party whose policy is fascism, the attitude is “meh, whatever”. Most people should have an opinion regarding this.
Not all elections need to be about new exciting changes. Boring is also an option.
Or maybe status quo is so bad people don’t care if it’s replaced by fascism. If that’s the case, then I agree it’s fully DNCs responsibility for the failure.