Explanations/etymology also appreciated!
For Joe Shmoe, it means a very average or below average person. It’s a derivation of the practice of using “shm-” to dismiss something (eg “Practice shmactice. We’re already perfect”).
And “John Smith” is meant to be the most average name or person imaginable, so they have the “most common” (citation needed) first and last name as well.
In Germany there is “Max Mustermann”, which basically translates to Max Template-man. It’s the default German name used for templates of official documents like passports and such.
Don’t forget Otto Normalverbraucher. Nobody cares about Otto Normalverbraucher.
Don’t forget his wife, Erika Mustermann, geb. (née) Gabler. She’s usually the one used for passports these days. I think there’s a whole Mustermann family living in these templates.
Isn’t it Erika Musterfrau?
Sometimes, but I mostly see her name as Mustermann.
In German there are also derogatory uses for the forenames “Kevin” and “Otto” for example. Often used to depict not well educated persons that have made extremely stupid decisions/choices.
In Arabic its “فلان الفلاني" “fulan al-fulany”, which roughly translates to “someone from some family”
spoiled all the fun :)
Japan, you usually use “Taro Tanaka” as the goto placeholder name. Tanaka is a very common surname here and it’s super easy to write as well (田中). Sato is actually the most common but also a lot harder to write (佐藤). Tanaka is also a very “working class” name, it litearlly means “in the rice field” and most likely comes from families with a background of rice farmers. Taro also a very common given name; there have been quite a few Taro Tanakas throughout history despite being the placeholder name on most forms and the like. Taro, incidentally means “Big/Strong Son”.
I am not sure offhand of a female equilvalent, it’s usually Taro as the placeholder.
Along with Tanaka, Yamada (山田) is also often used as a placeholder surname. It’s a comparably common name that’s also simple to read and write.
As for female placeholder given names, IMO the closest equivalent to Taro would probably be Hanako (花子). I’ve seen adverts that show sample credit cards or forms bearing these names.
For example, an ad for a Toyota financing promotion might feature the name Toyota Taro on the sample application form. Or in a Mitsubishi UFJ credit card ad, the happy-looking lady in the ad will be using a credit card that bears the name Mitsubishi Hanako.
Hm, well about 40% of our population is named Nguyễn. I don’t think there’s an equivalent expression, but I’d choose Anh Nguyễn. In addition to being a name for both genders, ‘Anh’ just means something like ‘sir’ or ‘older brother’.
In the Netherlands there’s “Jan Modaal”, modaal (modal) referring the most commonly occurring value in or peak of a distribution. This name is used often when representing the experience of the most average Dutchman.
It’s especially often used in financial discussions and journalism, like “owning a house is getting further out of reach for Jan Modaal.”
We also have the slur of “sjonnie en anita” when talking about lower class, anti social people, “sjonnie” being the man and “anita” the woman. Both are very common names in older generations, less common in younger generations.
Would Jan Lul be relevant to this discussion?
Ingrid en Henk, too, for the run of they mill boomer stereotype
Germany uses Max/Erika Mustermann – literally Sampleman. It’s used for example on official sample pictures of our IDs. Some authorities in erlin have startet to use the gender neutral name Manu Mustermann.
That’s the official version, but at least when I talk about some average dude it’s way too long and artificial, I don’t think the name Mustermann actually exists.
When I think of the most common name to use in casual conversation, I’d probably go for Müller (maybe Peter? Though the first name is probably heavily generation-dependent).
In older publication you may alse find references to “der deutsche Michel” (the german Michel, short for Michael) as a somewhat condescending reference to the average citizen who is very hesitant to adopt new concepts and tech and not always able or willing to understand complex concepts. Often used to remark that a product/idea will not have a chance on the market because “der deutsche Michel” doesn’t see the pointor would never pick it up.
Haven’t seen that in a while though, I guess Germans have become more open to new stuff :)
also “Otto Normalverbraucher”
Some others in the Anglosphere:
Fred Bloggs - no idea where it’s from. Related to “bog” as in bog standard maybe?
Tom, Dick and Harry - is ages old. Even as far back as Shakespeare you can see the triplet evolving. “Tom, Dicke, and Francis” : Henry IV, Part I
I’ve always heard it as Joe Bloggs. The Bloggs bot is believed to be a derivation of bloke
In the UK it is Joe Bloggs
In Norway we have “Ola Nordmann” and “Kari Nordmann”. Ola and Kari are pretty common and generic names. Nordmann literally means Norwegian, but can also be used as a last name.
In US legal cases, “John Doe”, “Jane Roe”, and similar names are used for pseudonymized legal parties.
For instance, the plaintiff in the famous abortion case Roe v. Wade was one Norma McCorvey, identified as “Jane Roe”.
A group of unidentified people appearing as plaintiffs or defendants may be called a group of “Does”, from the name John Doe.
The words doe and roe both refer to deer, which are common wild animals in North America — and as wild animals, represent an arbitrary unspecified person. A doe is a female deer; and while “roe” can also mean fish eggs, roe deer is a common European species of deer.
We have the phrase ‘every Tom, Dick and Harry’ which is like that (UK)
If we’re talking about a generic person it’s usually Mr/s Smith or Mr/s Jones (near Wales)
France: Martin Dupont
But I prefer Dominique Dupont as the first name is both for men and women.
In Spain we use “Fulano de Tal”. It seems Fulano comes from the arabic language, meaning “Anybody”. We use it when we don’t the name of a person we are talking about, or we really don’t care to know the name. Apart of Fulano, we also use Mengano.
Fulano/Mengano for men, Fulana/Mengana for women.
I guess our John/Jane Smith would be Pepe/Pepa García.
In my country (Spanish speaking) we say “Fulano de tal” Fulano is kinda like a template name nobody really is named like that. “De tal” really means something like “from somewhere”.
We dont out it on the graves, but we use it as slang for situations where we need to refer to someone generic like “imagine a fulano de tal doing xxxxxxxxxxx”.
There are other names like Zutano, Mengano, etc.
Edit: My mom sometimes uses “Miguel Perez”. Those 2 are very common first and last names.
In Brazil (Portuguese speaking) we also use Fulano de tal. I didn’t know it was used in other countries!
We also “José Ninguém” and “Maria Ninguém” to mean someone who’s a nobody. It literally means Joseph/Mary (very common names in Brazil) Nobody.
There’s also a name that expresses the same feeling of ‘Joe Schmoe’ in pt-br: ‘Zé Roela’
And to expand on Fulano’s family, we must not forget Beltrano and Ciclano.
There’s something similar in Italian, Tal dei Tali. Literally something like that one of those ones
Does this came from arabic influence?
To refer someone without a name or generic name we sometime say Fulan bin Fulan meaning someone the son of someone
