I’d go even further and say that people who entirely focus on rightwing idiots are grifters. I’ve got this feeling everytime I see some entertainer endlessly make fun of how American republicans (or any equivalent for outside of America) are stupid. Because that’s too easy, and, if you’re remotely on the left it’s absolutely obvious that those people are beyond saving. You don’t learn anything by watching mildly lefty clowns attack the ones who are so far on the right that everyone who’s not a fossil fuel lord can get behind.
Only the ones who punch right on their right do actual political effort because they contribute to the pipeline that lead to revolutionary politics.
Frankly, shouldn’t we abandon the whole “left-right” dichotomy? It seems false, just another obfuscation of the bourgeoisie politics. You either support the elimination of capitalism as a system (and thus class exploitation) ooor you don’t. That’s it. Socdems, republicans - does it matter if they all wish to retain the system as is?
Yeah you’re right it’s ultimately pointless when you take revolutionary politics into consideration. For example, are the anarchist on our left because they are more extreme or are they on our right because idealism is closer to bourgeois politics? That’s a pointless question.
I just wanted to express the fact that some political factions are just so stupid and far from us that it doesn’t make sense to spend energy criticising them. Criticism is only useful on people who share a certain ideological proximity.
I was always saying that the only noticeable line between left and right lies right on the line between socialism and capitalism. It’s not that the left and right dichotomy is useless by itself, but it is useless in the context of mainstream because capitalist propaganda managed to convince most people that rightwingers like succdems and liberals are “on the left”.
And more important, where to put the so called “anticapitalists” who are not only fruitless utopians but also toe the state department line and wreck all the time?
On Reddit, I was part of a leftist sub that became increasingly hostile to “tankies”. I pointed out the “no leftist infighting rule”, and some dude said “yeah, but I’m punching right” and called Stalin an imperialist. It was actually the moment that made me leave that shithole site. Thank goodness for Site B (Lemmygrad).
I’ve had similar experiences, likely on that exact sub.
If it is the sub I’m thinking of, I also ditched Reddit right after I had an interaction there. It really made me wonder what the fuck I was even doing.
Mine was the miniature hobby sub, Sigmarxism. Honestly, I wouldn’t doubt if similar shenanigans have happened on every leftist subreddit that wasn’t explicitly Marxist-Leninist.
Wild haha, I was thinking ShitLiberalsSay. That was really the era of socialist-subreddits-under-siege, wasn’t it? Anti-“tankie” mod coups, struggle sessions that wound up getting actual anti-imperialists banned, etc. etc.
It probably started earlier, but when the Ukraine business began, that’s when I saw the full-mobilization of anti-communist efforts and crackdowns, the attempts to throw MLs (or at least any MLs who didn’t demonize Russia) under the bus. And over time, as they banned and censored and ostracized those that spoke out, the “socialist” subs became more and more liberal. I was relatively new to Reddit and I’m pretty sure it’s not the first time, but it was the first time for me.
I had used reddit for 2 years IIRC when the quarantine hammer finally hit GenZedong – I was never into Chapo so I didn’t see that whole thing, though I knew a little bit abt hexbear.
Tbh GenZedong was a weird one for me. I considered myself a Maoist at the time, but everything people were saying there just made sense. I repeatedly tried to synthesize my idea of Maoism with what was being presented to me, but wound up just coming full circle back to ML proper. Some of the regular posters over there were rather unduly mean to me, but regardless without that exposure I probably wouldn’t be where I am (ideologically) today.
Then, one after another, it seemed like every last refuge for MLs was destroyed. Like you said, left-unity rules became “anyone but tankies (who are basically fascists anyway)”. SLS started banning anyone critical of the western NATO-Ukraine narrative. r/SRA, r/communism101, r/socialism, etc. all became cesspools of tankiehate and seemingly little else.
Real reason I ditched reddit entirely is cuz I told a self-professed ancap dude on SLS that he should end his life, and that the world was worse off for the fact that he had had children. Realized what overexposure to meaningless shit-takes (rather than engagement in theory and practice) was doing to me, and I didn’t like it. I like it here a lot better – I can do the occasional dunking while still mainly engaging with shit that actually matters. And most everyone’s a lot nicer!
Yeah, I’ve burned more than a few accounts for going a little too far in a heated discussion… Lemmygrad is a lot better for my mental health. They may call us an echo chamber, but honestly it’s the one place we aren’t bombarded with hate for thinking critically.
I wish I had been a Maoist. Until 2020, I was an amorphous self-proclaimed communist that hadn’t read anything beyond the Manifesto, and couldn’t decide if China and Stalin were bad or not. At least you held a position with literature and theory behind it before becoming a ML.
I remember within a year that sub went from “the Holodomor is Nazi propaganda” to “omg redfash tankie”
That’s weird, I still occasionally browse SLS and it is very clearly a ML sub. They constantly call out the “China bad” bs and Ukrainian Nazis all the time.
Maybe it’s changed for the better recently. I remember a bit of a mod coup at one point, and when the SMO started it was a battlefield there. IIRC a new rule was put into place regarding “defending” the SMO on the basis of dodging a reddit quarantine, and thusly all kinds of shit takes flooded posts and “left unity” seemed to disappear overnight. Maybe now that things have chilled a little bit and the narrative is showing cracks, they’ve reverted it.
Everyone expects Republicans to suck ass, and the liberal ”sir you are a hypocrite for saying you’re anti-big government, yet supporting abortion bans! Have you no decency SIR!?” shit is something they shrug off.
???
Can I clarify anything?
What does “punching right” mean?
Sort of like “attacking people that are right wing”.
The meme’s basically saying “I’m making fun of right wing people, if Democrats don’t like it, why are they on the right?”
