• Jhex@lemmy.world
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    21 hours ago

    why are people frothing over Bluesky? this is just Twitter but owned by a different oligarch

    • Spezi@feddit.org
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      19 hours ago

      Yeah, why would I use BlueSky when I could just use my favorite platform named Threads?

      Tap for spoiler

      Just kidding

      • Jhex@lemmy.world
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        19 hours ago

        Same here… even when Twitter was not even in the sights of fElon I found it to be super toxic. I signed up because “it was the best way to get the news” and left in about 4 days

    • Uniformly9@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      18 hours ago

      Because it isn’t just Twitter. Nobody can buy the network, the same way nobody can buy email.

      • Anyone can host a server.
      • Anyone can make an app.
      • Anyone can make an algorithm.
      • Anyone can make a moderation service. Users can freely pick a server, app, algorithm, and moderation service.
      • dnzm@feddit.nl
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        15 hours ago

        Yeah, no, not anybody can host a server. Sure, you can host a PDS, but the AppView still wasn’t open source last time I looked, and hosting a relay requires tens of terabytes of storage, not to mention the bandwidth to keep up.

        Meanwhile, people host actual activitypub instances on repurposed routers and their car entertainment system…

        • Uniformly9@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          6 hours ago

          Ngl thanks for the detail, I went and had another look so correct me if I’m wrong.

          So if we wanted to undermine Bluesky’s currently - hopefully temporary - centralised state, we would need multiple community modified PDSs, a widely rehosted open source AppView webapp & iOS/Android clients, a very expensive relay that is community controlled via non profit or something, and then we would be federated with each other and the bluesky infrastructure too?

          Sounds like a lot of work just to recreate the user-end functionality of ActivityPub :/ Very confused why they felt the need to invent ATProtocol? I have heard some vague praise of it over AP but I think I’m not technical enough to really properly make that comparison. It’s nice that ATProtocol gives you ownership of your data though.

          Perhaps Mastodon/ActivityPub-apps need to improve their onboarding process and user experience. Maybe include the custom feeds feature for Bluesky too. Something has to have gone wrong for Mastodon to have failed where Bluesky succeeded.

  • arc@lemm.ee
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    23 hours ago

    Bluesky is like Twitter but with about 1/10th the idiots, and no mechanism that the idiots can elevate their racist, moronic hot takes above other comments.

    • supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz
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      21 hours ago

      Bluesky will follow the same enshittification trajectory Twitter did, it is just the beginning of the rollercoaster where the coaster is slowly brought up to the top to be launched… and everyone is exclaiming “wow I haven’t even thrown up yet!” as if that was any indicator of how much they were about to throw up…

      • arc@lemm.ee
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        18 hours ago

        Maybe it will, but for the time being it hasn’t. The experience is so vastly better than Twitter, that it’s a no brainer to jump over. It also helps to have a decent competing platform that people like to suck users and influence away from the platform that Musk turned into a cesspit.

      • MarkalAlvarez@lemmy.world
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        19 hours ago

        I don’t think it will go down the same path as Twitter, since Bluesky is open source and available on Github other devs will have the possibility to improve it or create a better version of it but with the more users joining it might necessary to monetize it to better cover the costs. I would love to see everyone switching to the Fediverse but it’s not very intuitive for the average end user with the instances and the fact that you need to target a user and an instance to follow it

  • deczzz@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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    16 hours ago

    Decentralized FOSS socials are great technical achievements but I feel like the actual product that users will interact with are worse copy cats of already established social platforms. Mastodon is a Twitter clone, Lemmy is a reddit clone, peertube is a youtube clone. I love these FOSS/decen. platforms but the frontend that users actually interact with are just copies of already popular platforms, just with another backend. What innovative FOSS/decen. social platforms exist? Not talking about the backend but the user experience.

  • Mio@feddit.nu
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    20 hours ago

    Good with some competition. We need much more in that area.

  • ArchRecord@lemm.ee
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    2 days ago

    To anyone bemoaning BlueSky’s lack of federation, check out Free Our Feeds.

    It’s a campaign to create a public interest foundation independent from the Bluesky team (although the Bluesky team has said they support them) that will build independent infrastructure, like a secondary “relay” as an alternative to Bluesky’s that can still communicate across the same protocol (The “AT Protocol”) while also doing developer grants for the development of further social applications built on open protocols like the AT Protocol or ActivityPub.

    They have the support of an existing 501c(3), and their open letter has been signed by people you might find interesting, such as Jimmy Wales (founder of Wikipedia).

    • supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz
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      21 hours ago

      This is such a half-assed dog and pony show.

      They have millions in investment, why do they need someone else to fund this? Why don’t the bluesky team directly and materially support them?

      This is a core aspect of Bluesky’s marketing and they asking other volunteers to help make them rich.

      • Fedizen@lemmy.world
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        20 hours ago

        Until there’s overt advertising its unlikely to enshittify the normal way. That doesn’t mean it won’t, just that a different capital process is at work. Wikipedia has outlived most of “web2.0” because its funded by donations and run by volunteers.

        • supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz
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          11 hours ago

          Until there’s overt advertising its unlikely to enshittify the normal way.

          Trust me we will be deep into that territory so fast it is going to make your head spin.

          Wikipedia has outlived most of “web2.0” because its funded by donations and run by volunteers.

          Private equity and VC funding can’t directly buy Wikipedia and dissect it because it is an at least somewhat functional non-profit organization. That is the only reason.

    • ZeroOne@lemmy.world
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      23 hours ago

      The only thing the Fediverse is missing is way to migrate from 1 instance to another

      • ArchRecord@lemm.ee
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        21 hours ago

        It actually does exist, at least on Mastodon, but is still very janky (e.g. old posts aren’t moved over due to “technical limitations”)

        Automatically makes people unfollow your old account and re-follow your new account, then makes your old instance’s link redirect to your new instance’s one.

    • ipkpjersi@lemmy.ml
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      1 day ago

      I feel like the reason the reason why it’s taking off so much is because it’s not federated.

      It’s like people hear the term federation and they get afraid. I know it’s not that simple but still.

      In other words, people don’t know what they actually need.

      • nexguy@lemmy.world
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        23 hours ago

        I don’t think 99% of people who have joined bluesky have any clue what federation is or means. They do know what “not twitter” is however.

      • LandedGentry@lemmy.zip
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        1 day ago

        People are not afraid of the term “Federation.“ They literally have no clue what it is.

        It’s the instance concept I find consistently to be an issue. It’s an extra layer/barrier to entry. You don’t just create an account. You have to understand what an instance is and then determine which one you’re joining and what that means for your moment to moment usage of the platform.

        • 3dmvr@lemm.ee
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          1 day ago

          Yeah I was confused on if it was connected, if I was explaining it to myself id say that the fediverse has interconnected forums that all serve the same content and can be accessed by making accounts on different websites or apps.

          Lemmy, mbin, piefed, etc. are all ways to access the interconnected forum/threads side of the fediverse.

          Mastodon, sharkey, plaroma, etc. are all ways to access the interconnected microblogging slide of the fediverse.

          They all have different features, like mbin has account reputation, piefed has topics which let you sub to multiple related communities at once, etc., but the content is shared between those that serve the same type of content.

          Since they’re all built ontop of the same protocol ppl can always come in and build on top of it or make hybrids while still letting everyone access the same content. Like mbin having both microblogging (tweets) and threads, letting you post and view both from the same account/website.

          • 3dmvr@lemm.ee
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            1 day ago

            And it legit takes 5 minutes to sign up for 5 instances and see the differences, mine showed the same content for the most part, only lemmy.world was missing the piracy community, other than that it was all the same and any nervousness I had about it went away after seeing the feeds being the same.

            • LandedGentry@lemmy.zip
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              23 hours ago

              Yeah but people don’t want to set up 5 accounts to understand alt-reddit. They want to download a clean app that takes seconds to set up and just go. Friction is friction.

              Not everyone likes to tinker and poke and prod

              • spirinolas@lemmy.world
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                23 hours ago

                Not only do I don’t mind multiple instances, I welcome it. It’s a feature for me, not a bug. But having to create multiple accounts is a no-no and what keeps people away. People say you only need one but that’s not true if you want to be active in multiple instances.

                If the fediverse had a way to unify account creation, that would be a game changer. It’s pretty much what’s holding the fediverse down, be it Lemmy, Pixelfed, PeerTube, etc. It’s frustrating because without that limitation I could see the corpos being given a run for their money.

                • LandedGentry@lemmy.zip
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                  23 hours ago

                  I think maybe I mis-conveyed my point. I love the way this is all structured. The problem is that it is not accessible to laymen at first glance. I tried the “it’s like email” approach and people’s eyes still just glaze over. They want to download an app, create their account, and jump into the action. Anything beyond that requires a lot of buy-in unless they are already somewhat technically inclined.

                  As I said in another comment, I find the simplest thing to do is just set up the account for them, pick out an instance for them and tell them what it is, and then once they’ve stuck it out and get their bearings then open the door a little wider and explain Federation, the nature of different instances, etc. My only goal is just to get them on at all.

              • 3dmvr@lemm.ee
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                23 hours ago

                they should understand by the 2nd one, I just wasnt sure where I wanted to commit, it became fun by the 2nd one to pick an instance like a club

              • 3dmvr@lemm.ee
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                23 hours ago

                there really isnt much friction either if you dont cate about piracy otherwise id have stayed on lemmyworld when vyjr reccomended it, they really just need to try it, I complained until I tried it

                • LandedGentry@lemmy.zip
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                  23 hours ago

                  But even then you have to explain the whole subscribed vs local vs all situation. Then defederation, so they know that there is stuff they can’t access without creating another account on another instance.

                  No matter how much we simplify it it’s simply not that simple. At least not compared to traditional social media. And we can sit here and call them lazy for not learning how it works or we can do more to try to meet people where they’re at.

                  What I’ve been doing lately is pointing people a good app like Voyager, tell them not even to think about an instance and just join the one I tell them to join (For instance I tell my queer friends to join blahaj), then as they poke around I started explain explaining more things.

                  It’s kind of like Linux. People obsess over their first distro and then they realize it’s really easy to swap distro’s. So usually I just tell people to get something very simple like mint or pop and just dive in until they learn what they actually want.

      • ArchRecord@lemm.ee
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        1 day ago

        I don’t personally think it’s because of that. Sure, federation as a concept outside of email has a bit of a messaging problem for explaining it to newbies, but… everyone uses email, and knows how that works. This is identical, just with it being posts instead of emails. Users aren’t averse to federation, in concept or practice.

        Bluesky was directly created as a very close clone of Twitter’s UI, co-governed and subsequently pushed by the founder of Twitter himself, who will obviously have more reach than randoms promoting something like Mastodon, and, in my opinion, kind of just had better branding.

        “Bluesky” feels like a breath of fresh air, while “Mastodon” just sounds like… well, a Mastodon, whatever that makes the average person think of at first.

        So when you compare Bluesky, with a familiar UI, nice name, and consistent branding, not to mention algorithms, which Mastodon lacks, all funded by large sums of money, to Mastodon, with unfamiliar branding, minimal funding, and substantially less reach from promoters, which one will win out, regardless of the technology involved?

  • scarabic@lemmy.world
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    2 days ago

    Is this 30 million accounts created? Active user numbers would be a lot more meaningful.

    As an illustration, if you have a platform that’s gaining 100,000 users each month and losing 100,000 other users each month, it’s basically going nowhere. But it will eventually reach this “30 million users” milestone too if all it means is account creations.

    • ipkpjersi@lemmy.ml
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      1 day ago

      Active user numbers is probably less than 1 million, but still, 30 million accounts created is quite likely pretty good.

      • scarabic@lemmy.world
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        1 day ago

        It’s something, but there’s really no frame of reference to know if it’s good or how good. Because companies rarely talk about this number. Twitter might have billions of accounts created if we look at all time.

        Actives are what count.

  • ErinCrush@lemm.ee
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    2 days ago

    As a former mastodon believer, Bluesky is so much better. I’m sorry but the kind of content I wanted on mastodon was never there. Bluesky feels good. Things change, for sure. For now though? This is the best we have for a replacement for Twitter.

    • QualifiedKitten@lemmy.world
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      1 day ago

      I never actually used Twitter, but recently made accounts on Mastodon, Bluesky, and Pixelfed.

      Pixelfed has been my favorite of the three so far… I’m finding that the image-based focus means my feed is mostly fun stuff, that leaves me feeling happy, not gloom and doom of news, snark, etc.

      I’m not sure how long I’ll use Mastodon, but I’ve been finding hashtags and users that I’m interested in following and interacting with, and the keyword filters have allowed me to limit (but not eliminate) the depressing stuff.

      Bluesky pissed me the fuck off since I couldn’t find a way to follow hashtags, only users, and the Lists thing was just not what I wanted either. Bluesky’s filter is disappointing compares to Mastodon’s too, since Mastodon allows you to hide filtered words behind a content warning or hide them completely, while Bluesky seems to only hide them completely.

      • ErinCrush@lemm.ee
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        14 hours ago

        While you can’t follow hashtags you can follow “topics” like movies, tech, etc. They should do a better job of explaining how to use that feature though.

        As for pixelfed, I’d love to use it. But the only use I have for Instagram is following local bands. Although there is a new site that’s popped up recently that’s like Instagram with a forum but only for bands and musicians to communicate with their local scenes. Very cool, old Internet kind of feel to it.

    • naught101@lemmy.world
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      1 day ago

      Bluesky has the network effect, at least for some domains of content. Mastodon has about 50% coverage of my domain of interests, but that’s probably way less for many people.

      Mastodon has the guaranteed lack of enshittification via decentralisation. Bluesky is promising it, but it seems far from guaranteed, and if it doesn’t happen, I’m betting it’ll enshittify about 4 times faster than twitter, because everything does these days…

      So Bluesky is probably a better bet in the short term for general users… I’m glad people are escaping twitter at least. But I’m sticking with Mastodon, 'cause fuck going through all that again in a couple of years.

    • VitoRobles@lemmy.today
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      2 days ago

      I tried to figure out Mastodon a few months ago. I’m with you.

      Someone asked me to follow them on Mastodon. I couldn’t find them in the app. He sent me the direct link and it opened up a browser on my phone, refusing to recognize the app.

      I finally added them directly from a browser by by remembering which server I was in, log into that, visiting their link again, adding them from my logged in server, and then it finally appeared in the app.

      And if I’m dealing with thet level of monkeying around, how many others are? How the hell are we supposed to contribute and add content and find social circles when we’re fighting with the UI?

      Lemmy seems to have figured out how to not make a sucky experience with multiple servers.

      • SilentKnightOwl@slrpnk.net
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        1 day ago

        Yep, if even tech-savvy folks struggle with following people via links, the average user is going to feel totally lost. It’s these minor UX issues that keep holding federated platforms back.

      • BigAssFan@lemmy.world
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        1 day ago

        On Mastodon I have no trouble interacting with other users there. I have 2 accounts running on different instances - one global and one local. No trouble at all finding an account on either of them.

    • Akasazh@feddit.nl
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      1 day ago

      I dont like either, but then again I couldn’t get into twitter. The microblogging is not for me. I made accounts on mastodon, bluesky, pixelfed et al just to improve the numbers

    • anon593839@lemmy.world
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      2 days ago

      I find Lemmy to be a better reddit alternative than Mastodon is a twitter alternative.

      The lack of an infinitely scrollable algorithmic feed in Mastodon is definitely better societally, but let’s be real, the algorithmic feed is just way more fun to scroll in blue sky.

    • mayumu@ani.social
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      1 day ago

      I tried Mastodon two times in the past. I love the idea of federation and really want it to work. There’s just too much friction though.

      First you have to choose an instance. If there isn’t a sensible default preselected when you download an app you already lost almost all non-technical people.

      But I’m a technical, motivated in